065 | Nicola Olianas | The Advocacy Journey to Become the Bartender's Handshake | Fernet Branca & Carpano Antica Formula

Welcome to the Maffeiro Drinks Podcast, I m your host, Chris Maffeiro. In episode 65 I discussed with Niccolo Liana's the importance of creating demand and building advocacy. We dive into Fernet Branca's coin's role in connecting bartenders globally. Nicola explained its origins, rules and traditions and how it became a key symbol in the bartending community. Nicola also covers brand advocacy, Fernet Branca's passionate culture and the importance of maintaining brand authenticity and loyalty.

He highlights the importance of building a brand that is respected also by competitors, becoming an aggregator of industry people and consumers alike. I hope you will enjoy our chat. One last thing, if you enjoy this podcast, you will also like the Maffeiro Drinks Guides. You can subscribe free or paid on maffeirodrinks.com. I love the story and and especially because it like it's it's it's about taste profile, you know, because there is this, you know, it's inclusive, but there's also this exclusivity element that is like either you like it or you don't like it, or you learn to like it, you know, if you want to blend in in this community.

And that becomes the kind of like the entry barrier now, because it's like, it's not for everyone, but it's for people who know. You know? You know? It's welcoming, but also as a taste, it's it's non welcoming. No?

So it's it's a funny it's a little bit counterintuitive. No? Because when I Yeah. When I give it to someone, I always have a bottle. I I even have it here in in the back and, you know, it's everybody's like, wow.

This is really bitter. You know? It's a little bit like, I use it as an example, like like like with spicy food. No? You fight against it, but then you also go back to it.

No? Because there is that element that is like, no, but I need I need to try it again. You know? Like, I need to taste it again. But then also like the, the

You have this way educate yourself.

Educate yourself. Educate your palate. No. But then also like in the story, because, I'm always talking, you know, with drinks builders about, you know, building brands and building things. And it's also like an, an, a story about consistency, you know, you know, presence in the back bar, you know, like these bottles have been there either, you know, for many years or for many months, or, you know, there is a story of availability created that, you know, because you can do that kind of, you can reach the level of bartenders and shake to me if you are widely distributed, because then if you are not, you know, then I would go to a bar, ask for a, for a shot of Fernet Branca, and then they would be like, I don't have it.

You know? I, I feel that some brands rush a little bit onto that, you know, like they take that as an example, but then they cannot really make it happen now because they lack the availability. Yeah. But then also like the story of longevity and consistency, you know, I, I love that, you know, those things that you mentioned. And tell us like the story about the the the coin, you know, like, because that's also interlinked with the bartenders and Shay.

Right?

Well, the coin is something amazing. First of all, you don't ask for the coin. Let me give you the first rule, guys. The when the time is come when the time comes, you will get it. But don't ask for it.

Be present. Stay tuned. Be aware that every time there is a bronco event, there were some there will be some coins around. Every time there is a bronco ambassador, there will be some coin around that you might get lucky, or you beat by yourself at that bar, sipping in front of bronco. You step you see me stepping in, and I got you having for the bronco by yourself, that may be a moment that I get to the cause.

Because I I call them further coic moments. When you make a your a choice on your own time, not because somebody tell you to or because you wanna drive attention to yourself drinking for the branca, but because you made a choice. I'll go back to the coin in a second. I wanna wrap it up on what you say to me before. Every time I explain for the branca to people, I always have two, these three die type of people in front of me.

I have people that they love for the brand. And after I explain better to them what is for the brand, they understand why they love for them. And it's fantastic because then you understand why you do so. Then you have people that didn't like fernabranca, but I'm kind of good on convincing them. And they after they taste it, after they explain what is fernabranca, they understand why they like it.

They understand and they like funny bronchi. Okay. Then you have people that drink funny bronchi, they don't like funny bronchi. After the explanation, after the testing, they still don't like funny bronchi, but they respect it. And that is fantastic because no matter what, every time you're gonna talk about my brand, every time you're gonna hold the button in your head, the wording that you choose to describe my product will be a totally different for the one we were using before, because you respect the brand.

You know what is behind the bottle. You know what is behind the product. This is what we wanna achieve. Being the bartender handshake is something that you achieve when you are ever everywhere. This is my mantra.

My aim is that everybody, every bar should have a bottle of Frane And today, fortunately, no bar opens without having an assortment certain product. And one of those is front of. You cannot open a cocktail bar and not having a front of bracket, a Bronco maintenance assortment because those are the pillar of that serving industry. Okay. You have to have it.

And that is the thing that you achieve with many, many years. So you can be cool. You try to be the bartender choice, you know, but you have to become a category. Rum is a bartender choice. It's the choice of the hospitality.

Tequila is a is a science of, like, industry. You know? A serve a branca is the bartender issue. So the category and the brand altogether. And then everybody within the category is fighting.

Everybody within the tequila is fighting. Everybody within the rye is fighting. You know? And they want there are people creating new products and they try to achieve that. But, you know, it takes time.

Know? I always make an example. When I see company doing that, they look cute. They look very cute. They are making like, my my son that is trying to do things that adults do it.

They it looks cute. I'm I'm I'm pushing him to do it. I'm helping him to do it, you know, to to be, like, in a certain way, of course, to be polite and then cutting the things with your knives and fork, doing like things of the adult do it, but you look cute.

What many, many brand owners struggle in understanding is that a lot of these successful brands, like the ones you work with, know, they've been there forever, you know, like they

They're not shortcuts. In this industry, they're not shortcuts. If you have money, you can buy in liters, but you cannot buy and acquire that position in people's minds. That takes time. It takes so much time and effort and sacrifice because you always fighting with yourself to do shortcuts, take shortcuts.

And most of the time those shortcuts lead to having a poor product at the end.

I saw a quote today I was reading and it was like, everybody looks for a, for a shortcut, but the only shortcut is patience. This is the hardest thing to understand. And also like there is, you know, there is elements of, we need to finish the, the, the thing about the coin, but there is an element also about, you know, like the presence, you know, like the wide availability, like what Fernet Branc has done for me as an Italian, I I've never worked for the brand. They own a space in Italian culture, in Italian in in the Italianity, so to say. And then they use that to seed into countries where Italians went, you know, back in the days.

I mean, Argentina is a best example, United States, all the countries with a lot of like Italian immigration. And those things create the kind of like the fertile ground, you know, on which then you can build this thing because there wouldn't be any handshake or any trend or any coin for me if it wasn't for a super wide availability of this product, you know? And this is what people struggle to understand that they want to become hit by being in, you know, 50 bars or a 100 bars, but you cannot do it because, you know, like you don't have the ubiquity of that product, you know, like to, to really build on something. When people talk about going viral on Instagram and so on, you know, you need to build a foundation that maybe one post will go viral, but you cannot just post, you know, on Instagram hoping to get viral. Maybe you go viral, but then maybe they go back to your profile and they see you've got three photos and then they they will never follow you.

You know? So it's like you need to reassure people about, you know, it's something that it's there and it's there to stay, so to say, you know?

Any company can choose their own strategy to reach whatever they wanna reach. This company have one major thing on their side, which is time. Time is in our side on this market, of course, can, serve you surprises. You would not expect that there are some story of success of things that are very successful today. Let's see in twenty years time, let's see in thirty years time when maybe I won't be here anymore, you know, who knows whatever happened.

Let's not forget that this company, we had seven production sites all over the world. We don't have only have Milano and Argentina. We used to have them two in The US. One in New York at Tribeca, the other one in San Francisco. Yes.

We used to have a production site in Piazzo, one in France, one in Germany. So we were producing Perde Branca everywhere. So of of being Italian was not only the thing, of course, that we were we are proud of. We are from Milano, the company's from Milano, and we are Italian. But what we were promoting was not being Italian, Italian excellence, which is something that characterize only certain products that are from Italy.

No? Today, Italian excellence is only related to Italian. That's it. There are no other places in the world that can have the same claim for some products. There are other countries that can claim for other characteristic of being made in a specific area or for whatever.

K. Not saying that we are the only one. Buying the excellence is only Italian excellence that kind of identify. And so this is what we are exporting. Of course, we were exporting because Italian recognized on our products, like the high quality they were looking like a remedy, something they were drinking for many purpose.

So they, Italians in America wanted to drink from abroad. Italians in Argentina wanted to drink from. So we have to make the product available also for them. We add what's important, but there was also the pride of the founder of the company that wants to expand for the brat everywhere because they were so secure, so proud of the product. They wanted everybody to try.

They knew that uniqueness of this liquid will conquer many other consumer rather than just the Italians. So that's why they start going everywhere, you know, like an honestly, like a mission. I, I was reading like old letters of our sales guys back in 1800 writing back to their family because they were missing for eight months, nine months traveling all over the world. And it was like, you could tell we're not just on a business trip. They were there on a mission centered by this family.

Honestly, today, this is what we do because no matter what, although I mean, I became like a global here, a global there, head of advocacy, it doesn't matter. What I do every day is to crack open a bottle of Sone Branca and getting people to try them. This is what I do. This is what Nicole O'Branca, called Nicole O'Branca, the president of this company does every time he has an occasion, no matter what, whether he's in front of like a top manager of a whatever company or, of a, or maybe a servant, opens up the phone and say, have you tried my product? Try to try like that.

Have a seat. What'd you say? Everybody, this is what we do, no matter what. And these people, this is what we're doing. Get people to try the liquid, approach the bottle and share the passion, share this I

agree. And I, and I think like what you're saying is so interesting for me because it, it brings us back to not to be pushed by others, you know, to really focus on ourselves on what we love and do it with real passion. You make me think about, you know, have a portrait here of my great uncle that he was a Berseriera, you know, he was a marksman. He died

in Perth of war. And

he was working with my great grandfather and my grandfather, you know, and they were wholesalers. They had a shop and it was open for one hundred years. So this really touches my heart because the business doesn't exist anymore. It didn't survive to the previous, you know, conversation. But I got some letters of my great uncle, after which my father is named after, by the way.

And he was sending letters from the front, you know, he was in, in the trenches and he said, like, you know, we had an attack and I survived this time that eventually was killed, but he was always closing the letters with a big kiss to Nona and stay high to my customers. So imagine this guy who is fighting for life, you know, in the trenches on the Eastern Front.

Unbelievable.

You know, thinking about, of course, about his Nona, about his grandmother, about his customers that because what he was feeling, what he had left behind the family business that, you know, can they cope without me? You know, like say hi to my customers, my clients, you know? And we're talking about letters from 1916, 1915. So this is like what we still do as, you know, business people, but then sometimes we forget about, no, that in, you know, when we are fighting for the next quarter and results, you know, ultimately it's about really caring for what we really do, no? And being passionate about it.

As you said, you know, you still do, you know, you open a bottle and you make people try. No matter how many people reporting to you, you know, how many flights you take, how many countries you've visited, how many fancy parties and fancy suits you have, at home, you know, that's what you do because ultimately that's the basic, the most basic thing, the most unscalable things that we should master, because it's still, when you do it, it's like what, 10 people, 15 people, you know, trainings and you still do them.

I do one to one. If you ask me, I do one to one or 300, 400. It doesn't matter because you have, we have to change the perception of who are, who are the customer to us. If it's just like somebody that is, you know, we have to sell to, or it's somebody that is contributing to put food on the table of your son. That changes.

Every customer for me, every consumer, every person drinks on a Branca is putting a small part of the food on the table of my son. And this is how I approached my job every day, no matter what, no matter what, nobody had married people, I'm still doing it because that is a vital part of my life. And my, I respect my company because through my company, I can do that. And ultimately the consumer, everybody drinking, because one sip more contributes to more longevity of me being a father, having a house and be able to provide. One customer more is one person more is a person that's gonna buy a bottle of soda branca is gonna repeat the acquisition three times per year.

And there's more and more. And I never get mad if I don't see soda in the bar or in the restaurant. I see it as an opportunity to say, okay, that's why I do it.

That makes me, you know, evolve my thinking about advocacy trainings as well, because it's like, you know, like either people will basically continue to drink from the branca after your training session, or they will start drinking or they will continue not to drink it, but now they will be aware of why they're not drinking. You know, they will not say like, oh, I don't like it. No, like I don't drink that stuff. You know, they will be respectful in the way they convey the message. And basically all these three options, which are basically all the three sixty degrees option that you can have are positive for you in the end, because maybe next time they will say, no, actually I will give it a shot, you know, because I respect it even if I don't like it.

I'm not.

Or they will actually like

my son.

Playing to someone else that doesn't drink it to drink it. You know?

Yes. It's like my son. I mean, my objective is to switch him from I don't like it to, I don't understand it yet. Yeah. For everything, you know, I don't get it yet.

It's not that it's not for me. I don't like, I'm never gonna do it. I don't get it yet. I don't, you know, it might be another time. And this is a great achievement, you know?

You are maturing, you're evolving. As a worker, a working, you either bring the contribution on a small scale, of course, on everything that you do. Otherwise there's no point how I managed to do it for fifteen years because Chris, I've been doing it for fifteen years. Exactly the same thing. Exactly the same thing.

So I'm like, all right, okay. How do we do it? It's because it's an everyday, because it's your, it's your mission, it's your job. Because you have to replicate that. You have to convince people.

It's an everyday job and it's always different because they're different people, but the objective is always that, you know? That's why I say people, you know, when you're, you, you, want to do the brand ambassador or they wanna do this job. I say, guys, it has its own benefit. Of course, because we live outside, we get to see beautiful places and travel everything, but the job himself is that every day the same, Every day the same. And you can, you have to be every day the same because people are expecting you to be the same way you were like ten, five, six months ago, ten years ago.

It doesn't matter. So it's an everyday job. It's not, it's not that easy. And then you have to believe in your brand and you have to know every aspect of it.

I love it. I love it. So let's, I'm, I'm aware of, of your, your time. So let's just, wrap it up with, like, I think we owe an answer to, you know, how the, the coins, how the coin works in practice.

We should have another podcast only on coins. Only on coins. Would be fantastic. Now coins, Verbaca coins, just risk, right? Fabrica coins physically were born, I would say around 2003 or '4.

I'm not, I don't recall properly because there's no memory on that. They were created by an idea of two people working for Brantel. It was like a sales rep working for our distributors that at the time was in Philly in the West Coast Of The US. He was working in Nevada. He was the resident for Las Vegas.

Plus, one of, Fernabraca portfolio manager, working for us in the center. So there were like many ideas, many brainstorm that lead to that calling that we have today and that were connected together. First of all, they need something that officialize bartenders to be really part of this network of bartenders that love for the branca because everybody was into for the branca. Yes. I do shots.

I know the people from the bronco. I've been there. I know the reps. I know everything. I have the connection.

So they need something that make that thing official. K? Also, they want to have something that was always present in the bartender's life, everyday life, but was not like a t shirt that you have to take it off and wash it, no hat because maybe the hub doesn't see you of socks, whatever. So they want something that you would keep always with you and then you can spill it every time. And in Vegas, both bartenders and people always have in their head is a chip from the casino.

Whether you're a customer at a casino, or you are a bartender who works in the casino because you get tipped with the coin, with the chip. Yeah. So they came up with this idea of creating something that was a Ferne Branca coin that was given to bartenders, only selected bartenders. And the bartenders could keep always in their pocket as like, okay, I give it to you, but now you keep it and have it like there as a memory. So you put your hands in your pocket, you feel it, you feel Fernabranca.

Also, was something that connect people even without knowing each other. So like showing the coin on a bar top of another bartender bars, kind of like make a straight connections. Ah, you are a bartender. How did you get a coin? I meet Chris.

And then at the hotel, they give it to me. I know I got mine because he called, give it to me, blah, blah, blah, that connection connection. And that bringing people together, even if they don't know each other. Then we create a coin rules. Okay?

So Freddie Branca came with these coins, and then the coin were like the first coin was actually the the Freddie Branca logo, as we know, Branca the globe, and behind the back was the seven seven seven of a slot machine, typical like fish of a fantasties. Then of course, like creativity started, you know, because they, they make the second and then San Francisco made the coin, New York started making coins, Atlanta make the coin and then Washington start making a coin and Texas start making a coin. Every state's got it. I joined the company in 2010. I saw the coin.

I said, this is a fantastic idea. And I took the coin, brought it to Europe. So I started making a coin in 2011 in Europe with Sweden, Norway, and now we have everywhere. The other thing we created for the blackout coin rules. So every time I give you a coin, you should, you receive some coin rules that explain what you should do with a coin.

So always keep it with you. If asked to present the coin, you will always have to have a coin in your pocket with you. Otherwise, you have to pay me a shot. So if I give you the coin and I come back to your bar and I put my coin down, you don't have your coin because you left it at home. You left it in your wardrobe.

Okay. Coin, give me a shot. Because you always ask to have the coin with part of the rule. You cannot make a hole in the coin. You cannot modify the coin.

You cannot sell the coin. You cannot buy the coin. So there are some rules. And then there's the coin challenge game. The challenge game, the challenge coin, because this coin actually called challenge coin.

Every military group in The U S whether are fireworkers or firefighters or aeronautical, whatever, all the different groups, rangers, marshals, every group has its own coin, periodically produced for a specific year or for a specific group that were doing the specific year, whatever the other producers. So they are given to misbeep. Okay. And so when these people meet at the bar and they're off duty, of course, maybe they'll start telling, okay, I belong to that specific group. I've got this mission until the other guy say, oh, really?

Okay. Prove it to me. Do you have the coin? If you don't have the coin means you're lying means that you have to pay as a shot. So then I also start the coin challenge rule.

So everybody has a coin. When we go to coin, their parties, when we go to industry bars and thereby start saying, yeah, I got a coin. They give it to me. Oh, really? Let's have a shot of Fernet.

If that guy doesn't have a coin because he was lying, he has to pay. And then of course you don't wanna punish him. That is a way of, okay, instead of having a coin, I introduce you to people, come to the next event. You might gonna get a coin. What is your vow?

Where you comes from? Do you have a of Branca copters in the menu? Do, do people drink for a Branca? And they say, oh yes, come to my bar. All my stumps are shut off in a Branca.

We all love for a Branca. Then I go, I visit them, and I say, I make sure that it's true. And there's actually most of it is 100 times out. 10 out of 10 is true. They love for a Branca.

So that is the moment that I say, okay, I'm happy, very happy to know you guys. I have very happy to know this part. I think you should deserve a coin because I want to be the ambassador for the Bronco in this specific area that I did in. And that's it.

I love it. I love it. That's a really great story because I I heard many, many different theories about it. So I I thought it would be a good one to hear on this episode. And I guess that it would be clearer for many, for many people.

I think it was clear now. All pass it.

And remember, don't ask for the coin, like just to

With of you get your approach from you guys. Yes. If you were waiting two years for the coin and you asked me for a coin, most, most probably gonna wait about two years back. I'm sorry.

It resets the,

kind of, yeah, resets the timer. I can't sometimes I really do it with pleasure, a little guilty pleasure to say, I'm sorry. You should have asked for a call. Thanks

so much, Nicolas. Tell us how can people find you, reach out to you.

The best way to reach me, reach for me is come to Milano, Number 2. This is where we have the factory. That's where we have the museum that I invite everybody to visit, and this is where I live also. My apartment is within the production site. My house is within the Branca Museum, so I live there.

I smell from the Branca every day. Otherwise, I'm always traveling, so keep tune on Instagram and Facebook so you can actually see where is my program. On Facebook, I'm Nicole Oleanas, and then Instagram, I'm Nicole Oleanas. So you will see, like, a guy with a beard and from the Braca sunglasses. That's me.

Send me a message. Any question you have about our product, events or POI material, goodies, just doesn't matter where you are in the world. We have a personal representative from Sonebranca. I have finally an ambassador almost everywhere in the world. So I have somebody that's my alter ego everywhere in the world.

So contacting him is like contacting me to reach out just to say hello. I would much appreciate.

Fantastic. Thank you. Thank you so much, Nicolas. This has been a super interesting conversation.

No. Thank you. Thank you. Fantastic. Thank you for the opportunity.

And by I wanna say hello to everybody listening to this podcast, and I hope it was clear enough. Sometimes I get like drive by my passion and, hope it was clear. Okay.

That's all for today. Remember that this is a two part episode sixty four and sixty five, so feel free to listen to that as well. One last thing, if you enjoy this podcast, you will also like the Maffeiro drinks guides. You can subscribe free or paid on mafirdrinks.com.